[THE RELATIONSHOP] The Four Stages of Forgiveness (Episode #13)

The RelationShop crew discusses relationships seen on reality TV (90 Day Fiancé, Married at First Sight, etc.) and throughout Pop Culture in order to provide good relationship advice that works.

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This is The RelationShop where we expose reality shows and provide couples with real relationship advice. I’m Toya. And with me, I have Jason and Eric. Way, question way. So this is from Tracy. All right. Tracy says I hate to say this, but my husband has some annoying habits. I tried talking to him, but there is no real change. How do you handle an annoying spouse? I wouldn’t know what happened. Okay, There you go. Yeah. Annoying spouse. Hey, how do you handle your annoying spouse? I mean, what I just wish I was more specific.

Like, is it snoring? Is it smacking when you what? Do That’s annoying. Yeah, he day dreams a lot. Yeah. So, like in the middle of your sin, you’re talking Teoh. So here’s what I’m thinking. What I’m thinking. Loud, chewer, loud laugher. You are the person who likes snorts when they laugh for those people you get, Here’s what annoys me. I’m watching TV and watching the show, right? And somebody I won’t mention names. Somebody’s over here looking at Facebook and the video comes up like in the volumes up.

Like I watch TV. I don’t want to you Video, Right. Okay, so there you go. That’s mine. So here’s the reality, Tracy. Yeah. Tell us when you marry somebody, uh, you sign up for a unique set of unresolvable differences. I mean, that’s that’s something. That’s who they are. You knew that ahead of time. So you need to understand that you signed up for some of this stuff. Now I think there’s different things. Like chewing, too, with her mouth open. Like there’s man. There’s a manner category and come home.

Any change, some stuff, dinner stuff, they may not be able to help. So if you keep harping on somebody for something, they can’t change at some point, that’s gonna be devastating in the relationship because it’s gonna sound like you inherently don’t like who I am, right? Right. So is it a habit they can change? That would be one question. Is it something they can’t change? And then what do you need to do to just move on? Well, I’m guessing some of this. You shouldn’t know why you were dating right now.

Could it also be Tracy Tracy is Maybe it’s something in her where, where she’s, you know, the relationship kind of distancing, So everything’s in knowing that. So maybe she needs the self checker. So maybe she’s just irritable some Zola e. I don’t like how you all dismiss my daydreaming about that. Listen, listen, because sometimes I could be talking to a mind and then he’ll just kind of go off And then I’m just like, Hey, did you hear what I said? And that happens. And so that’s annoying.

Yeah, probably has nothing to do with the quality of what you’re saying. My question would be, Is he the only one that does is off when you see a kid starts, does it on a dog. You knew your here is what I would say, Tracy. If it’s something that they can change, then I think it’s a reasonable request to se, you know, could you not choose allowed? You do not, you know, Can you be sensitive over laughing, You know, whatever it might be if it’s something that it is difficult from the change now, I think you’re gonna start hurting a relationship.

If you’re asking somebody to not be who they are. Yeah, and it’s like, Oh, man, that’s you know, if it’s the way they make decisions, their pay some that’s personality driven, and you’re not gonna change that. So is it a little habit they can change? Talk about it. It is something more inherit to who they are. I think you got overlooking Tracy overlooking tracing well for anybody that has questions. Email those questions into TheRelationShop@power77radio.com. Today subject is intense. I would say Right way, I heard it said before the cliche.

Hey, man, A good marriage is just a union of two. Great for givers. Eso What would talk about today is forgiveness. We’ll say about forgiveness. What does God say about forgive? We address what forgiveness is, what forgiveness is not. And then we’re going to give you four stages of forgiveness so we can give you something practical If you go, I don’t know how to forgive. How do I know if I forgiven? We’re gonna give you some stuff today that will help you walk out forgiveness in your relationship.

But today’s crazy because we get so many messages in a church in the Bible, you’re going to get one message on forgiveness and in the world has a whole. Another set of forgiveness. What did they say out there? Here we go now. No, I’ve been taking grieve because I’ve gone from Garth to Konya, right? I do. In the Kanye. That wasn’t I didn’t get enough con your way out of your transition. I don’t know if you’ve ever heard of this guy. 50 cents. Uh, please. Golf It is you that?

Yeah, I got that way. So So check this out. So I ran across this about 50 set, right? All right, So there’s this song, this call. Forgive me, right. All right. So these layers construct me, and this would go a long while we’re talking about today. Of course. Most of the song in the beginning is blaming his mom, blaming stuff about about why, Why he is the way he is. But there’s this fine here that says the deeper the scars, the worst is the history. God, you ain’t gotta forgive me.

Just don’t forget me. Hear me? Lord, forgive me, for I have sinned over and over again just to stay on top. I recall memories filled with sin. So So what I’m hearing is, uh I don’t really want to forgive, but But God forgive me. I mean, is that where the world’s going to say that seems reasonable. Any average person, you know? Do you want to be forgiven? Yeah. Yeah. You like to forgive? No. Yeah. Bra now been impressed, man. In between, I don’t want to just glide past the fact that you stumbled on some fitty cent in between your toad the wet sprocket live.

Yeah, I’m a bombing rather whatever else, Teoh. Hey, you know, I mean, every now and then I got I got some in me, so I mean, you it comes out just the way you said I gots, um, in me says you don’t have You know that? All right, so So we got people like 50 cent. Yeah, throwing out their ideas on, you know, he said a bunch of stuff will tackle God forgive me or don’t forgive me, but don’t forget me. So we got forgive versus forget. Yeah, but I’m guessing that you to Toya and Jason spent ample time this week wasting your minds and energy and having some of your soul sucked out of you watching your favorite shows.

So is there anybody in no shows that struggle with forgiveness. Wow. So right now I forgive you for all right. I didn’t ask for it. It’s a also a top get So there’s a few week ago. I’m but But who were you thinking about? All right. So this week I have to go with Cory and ever. Yeah, I agree with that. Yeah, there. And they are on a 90 day fiance the other way. Because Cory is from America, Believe from the West Coast, Washington State or something. I don’t know anyway, So he’s from that side, and Evelyn lives in Ecuador. Ecuador.

So he left home to go move to Ecuador. He has taken care of her. They got a vacation property. They have a house, she has a car, go for all this, right? And they’re not even married. But anyway, um, so But in the past, she’s actually cheated. She says they were taking a break at the time, and he says that they really weren’t. But anyway, they’re gonna break. This is only 90 day fiance way to raise a lot when you break. Right. So she supposedly cheated and he said, you know, he for neighbor.

However, he brings it up all the time, All the time. Yeah, it’s clear. It’s clear he has. He hasn’t still hanging onto that right, and they mean it is created issue with them. And she She sees that as weakness in him, right? And And he and the bad part about it is she still good friends with the guy? She cheated it right? So he still comes around. I mean, to the point where it’s Cory. Hey, go hang out with this guy and and they have actually spent some time together on And that’s how.

Actually he learned some more detail about about Evelyn through that guy. So, yeah, there’s obviously some big issue there, but he clearly cannot let that go. Yeah, and let me make it clear for those of you that are familiar with court and Evelyn, I do not support their relationship at all, but it’s just a good example of him not really forgiving her. But I don’t even think they need to be together. I don’t think he should have spent all that money on her and but all of that, So I just want to make that clear.

But back to forgiveness. You know, when you truly forgive someone, it’s not so much of you saying you forgive, and then you bring it up all the time. It’s more of you for giving. You don’t have to forget it, but you just forgive and you just continue on and don’t blow it in their face. You’re just moving forward, you know? Right. Sorry you lost me on the You don’t condone their relationship. Tell me who you don’t conduct. Sidebar. Just Ugo stand. No, they should not be together. Cult.

You support any of the shows? Wait a minute. Let me. You know it might be somebody that you support. Their relationship will support their relationship because I feel like she’s just using him. You know it. But at the same time, Okay, here there is a good thing about them, so I feel like she’s using him. But at the same time, if he’s gonna be a type of man that could get used then Okay, right? Yeah. Okay. And I will say this. I mean, before he went to Ecuador, right?

He has to go get vaccination. Uh, he he he had he couldn’t do it without his mother he had to take his mother with him to get a vaccination way down. That further relationship right there. So scared. Scared of needles? Yeah, I do. Yeah, you know, But I don’t know, just but again, he put me He literally spent his life savings so they break up, which they should, but, you know, she’s he’s all his money in Ecuador. Yeah, he’s not even a citizen there. So that brings us to Yeah, there’s a lot of forgiveness that needs to go on on that show.

So what? What do we see? Let’s go world first and then Will will come back and go. God. All right. Right. I think I think. And the reason I want I want to end with God is if you’re willing to sacrifice the thing most important to you main in his son Jesus, as a symbol of forgiveness to all mankind. I think you get to write the rules on it. But before we get there, I see crazy stuff like you look on social media. You see people blasting people and see people turn around and claiming God or so what?

What have you experienced either personally or on social media. What is one of the world’s saying about what? Forgiveness in the got that I got that with my with my history of my ex, it was not pretty and Social Media was the platform, but what you could got. You could go on the page like even now you can go on the page and there’s stuff on self help of changed of turnover, new leave, you know about grace, mercy, forgiveness. But in the same breath, is it? And this is actually words that have been set, you know that forgiving is not the same is forgetting.

I don’t have to forget I forgive you, but I don’t have to forget. And so that’s the attitude that that comes out the social media on my end. So well, that’s a good question. So when you forgive, do you forget? No. Yeah, you just have this miraculous forgetfulness moment. I know I I agree with that, but I also see that as a crutches. I don’t have to forget which is really you just hanging on your really haven’t forgiven it is the way I see it. So the forgetting part, Yeah, I don’t know.

It’s It’s a crutch. Maybe he hanging onto it. So some people like Toya’s saying you don’t forget just logically speaking like you just not gonna get right what you’re saying I’m not forgetting as in basically the way it’s you. I’m not gonna let you forget. Know that I will make sure neither one of us forget alone and that Israel, Israel, Israel. Yeah, so no, but no, you can’t Logically, you’re not gonna forget. Um, But, I mean, that’s, you know, I don’t know that forgetting is a I don’t know that you want to forget because no, my mistakes in my past I don’t want to forget those.

I want to remember the mess that I created, so that doesn’t happen again. So I’m not asking the forget. But there’s a little bit in this behind that statement, though, when it comes. Yeah, I think it depends on what the remembering does, right? If remembering keeps you in a place of shame, that’s not healthy, right? If the remembering causes a person who’s been hurt to dwell on the offense and basically replay the hurt over and over and over again, that’s not gonna have them in a good place. right.

I think the around forgetting is is what are we doing with it? Always forget anything right now. You have all had pain in our lives induced by somebody else’s actions. And you’re just wake up one day and you’re like, what happened, right? Yeah. I totally forgot about that. Oh, yeah, I remember that now, right, Like, pain has a unique ability to in grain in our minds with vivid detail. Stuff that’s happened that we’ve seen that we’ve experienced. Right, Right. What about you, Toya? What you get? I’m actually thinking of the case that was in Dallas.

Uh, okay, that’s fine. Toya. Let’s bring the race car. Did you may be able to see this on your listening device, but the race card just walked into the room. Think of Amber, the police officer, Amber Guyer, who shot and killed bottom Gene in his apartment complex. And what I’m going to is the forgiveness of his little brother. So, you know, when they were being, you know, he asked for her to be able to come up so he could give her a hug and they hugged and cried, and he was just like, we’re but I forgive you.

I don’t know. I don’t know how my family feels that I didn’t have this conversation with them. But I forgive you. And, you know, all he really wanted was for her to have relation with Christ pretty much. But then when you go on social media so that we just talked about we have a lot of people that are like, Oh, he’s weak. Oh, you know, he should have been that e mean, that video viral and the narrative that came out that was amazing. Yeah, So that was kind of heartbreaking, because here he is showing Christ love, but the world we live in didn’t see it that way at all.

It was more of seeing him as a door matter. Seeing him as being weak or seeing him has fallen victim of saying as a black guy me to forgive. Like then it turned into the whole race of, you know, that the race issue of black people always forgiving white people, and it’s just sad that that’s where it went instead of just seeing, like, true, just true forgiveness, right? Well, and I think that goes, But I mean, like like in my case. In that case, it seems like that happens a lot where the reality is we don’t want to let people off the hook.

And so it feels like if I forgive you that I’m letting you off the hook and you got away with what you did. So I think that’s the way a lot of the worldviews forgiveness is. I can’t let you off the hook, right? So, yeah, I think that’s a unique tough case because we’re talking about the individual personal moment of these two people, which waas as Christ like is you can get right to not wish bad on a person. That dude even said that I would want you not to go to jail.

I want I’m worried about your salvation. Yeah, but I think the problem is that it’s hard to pull that situation out of what you’re saying Toya, which is the systemic issue, and we’re not going to go here a long time. But there’s clearly a difference in treatment between races and some of this stuff, and people are going out all that stuff. But let’s stay on the moment, not the politicized systemic. The moment was that was an act of forgiveness, right? Like you only do if you truly understand what God is meeting.

The boy backed it up with a hug. I mean, come on. Yeah, Li Mei. It’s big about the maturity of how old he is. 18 or something. I want to run through a couple of things and get you guys thoughts. First time I read some statements on what forgiveness is not. Yes, let’s clarify this. So forgiveness is not waiting for time to heal all the wounds. So it’s not just sitting around going. I’m just waiting for time to heal up. All that forgiveness is not letting the guilty person off the hook.

I think that sometimes the fear if I forgive now I’ve let him off the hook, and it may even be not only if I let him off the hook, but I basically told them they could do it again because I’ll have toe free him again. Forgiveness is not denying you’re hurt. Forgiveness is not being the door mat like, Toia said. Forgiveness is not conditional. Watches forgiveness is not forgetting. No, it’s not. You do not forget, but we’ll talk about what that really means. And here’s the Here’s the thing.

Forgiveness is not a feeling you’re not doing this because you feel like it. But if we’re talking the biblical sense, we’re doing it because it’s a biblical mandate. We understand Goddess forgiven us for much. And so now we turn around and our desires to forgive others in the way that we’ve been forgiven. So if you’re waiting to feel like forgiving somebody, bro, I think that’s the big feelings. A big deal, because I think that’s where a lot of this struggle with forgiveness comes from because it’s out of pain.

I mean, I have pain, and I want you to feel this pain, too. It’s so right feeling. I’m of course, feeling feeling to screw a lot of stuff up. But that’s your big hang up, trying to get rid of that feeling and really learning how to forgive. And that’s hard to do. Yeah, that’s hard to do, Absolutely. Let’s let’s read. I’m going to read you what forgiveness is and see what your thoughts are. So forgiveness is dismissing. A dead person knows you because they’ve hurt you, but you’re dismissing what they owe you.

Yeah, forgiveness is dismissing the demand that somebody owes you something back, huh? In essence, you’re saying I’m releasing you from where it appears like you owe me. Here’s a tough one. Forgiveness is extended even if it’s never earned. So sometimes we have this belief that they have to ask for it. They have to do some stuff, toe, earn my forgiveness back. No, no, no. It’s It’s not earned. You’re never gonna You talked about Jason earlier. Ah, something like adultery. Infidelity? Yeah. Yeah. You can’t do enough to undo that.

Like you will never get to a place in life where I I earned back what? I undid you. You have to just choose to forgiveness. Is this releasing resentment towards your offender? So I’m releasing the right to say or here. I’m sorry. I’m releasing my right to be bitter. I’m releasing my right to get even to exact vengeance. I’m I’m releasing a lot of stuff. You’re really at the end of the day releasing your rights towards the offense and I would even go so far to say you’re giving up the right.

This is the forgetting piece you don’t literally forget, right? But I’m giving up the right to bring it up again. Yeah. And I hope you’re getting to a point to get us to where we figure out how to do that. Because all of this right here that you’re telling me sounds cute. It sounds really good, but you owe me, man. I mean, that’s hard to get rid of. You obey. I mean, yeah. You know, there’s people out there that the infidelity has been there. There’s been an affair, and that ain’t cute.

And so you owe me. You hurt me. Way are gonna get to a point to teach me how to do this, right? Yeah, Just just I like Cliffhanger side. Hang in. Let’s go. Last 90 days. Less breaks of Bible in There’s multiple verses in the Bible that say that we’re to forgive because we’ve been forgiven. Washes 3 13 bear with each other and forgive whatever grievance it says you have against one another. Forgive, as the Lord for gave you. We have a model. And that was God for giving us.

There’s also Matthew. Six says that if you forgive others, God forgives you. If you don’t forgive others, God will not forgive you, right All right. All right. I’m gonna interrupt a little because I got to know this. What about what about the spouse? That is a repeat, like, Okay, So let me ask you this way. How many times do I forgive by spouses? Whatever. They keep doing the same thing over and over. How many times do I do? I have to keep forgiven. Well, Peter well, you remember.

And Matthew Peter as Jesus is a thinking. But remember, he be Peter thought that he was going the extra mile. So he’s a Jesus. How many times we gotta forgive seven. Because the rule of thumb was three on. So he’s like, I’m a double it and up it want hate a god. I’m so holy. Seven times 70 times seven. Which means there’s no end of forgiveness, not Jason you’re talking about. There is a reality of if somebody keeps doing the same offense over and over, Do you set a healthy boundary to say a behavior is not acceptable in that kind of?

Absolutely. Do you need to keep putting yourself in a situation to keep receiving the same level of pain and behavior and know you can set boundaries. But as far as forgiveness goes, yeah, biblically, you are supposed to do that, cause it says now. I just mentioned the verse. Word said, If you forgive, gaffer gives you, If you don’t don’t anybody here that in in forgiveness towards salvation, that’s a different issue. So God’s judicial forgiveness is settled at the cross. Our sins are forgiven. This is a relation.

Allow a day to day relational forgiveness, like if you choose not to forgive your spouse, that’s gonna affect your communication. That’s gonna affect feelings of bitterness towards one another, that kind of stuff. So that’s what that verse is talking about. If you’re not forgiving others, it is impacting your relationship with God because he’s withholding that day to day forgiveness again, not salvation. But our intimacy, our communication, our connection. That’s why if you ever run into a believer that is claiming a deep connection in great intimacy with God, but they have unforgiveness and bitterness in their life there, they’re playing a game.

Yeah, is not really there, So yeah, let’s let’s talk about four stages of forgiveness. What does this look like? We’ve set the biblical mandate. We know what forgiveness isn’t is not. We know that if you’re a believer in Christ Jesus, forgiveness is not an option, right? It’s an expectation because you have first received the greatest forgiveness of all time. You now need to extend it to others. So stage one is simple. It’s just face the offense. You don’t need to minimize it. Don’t excuse it. Don’t act like it didn’t happen.

Just face the offense. He address it. Here is what you did to me that cause pain. You gotta face the offense. Face the offense. Not every day, though. Bring him. Bring it up. What you did to me is that that’s that’s beating the person that we are. Except for giving. This is giving up the right to bring it up. A lot of people don’t want to even address the offense because they’re not confrontational. And so they’re just gonna well, just not talk about it. And I’m just going to kind of forgive.

I think if you’re going to really move into forgiveness, you got to say, Here is what it waas and here’s here’s what happened. Step do is just you got it. You got to feel it some right I don’t deny your pain. Don’t run around with false guilt. Don’t like, feel it because you did this to me. You lied to me. You made fun of me in front of my friend. What? Whatever it was and that really hurt. That was devastating to me. And I think it’s OK. Toe communicate and talk about This is how the pain happened to me.

And once you’ve identified it and really sat in the pain of it, then then it’s time you got to make a choice. You gotta forgive the offender. That’s what we call the I think you can. That looks different depending on the circumstance. If you’re wondering how you should do it, what it looks like, I say talk to a trusted friend because sometimes we think, why I got a call. Everybody who’s ever hurt me. I got a call like my girlfriend from 10th grade, and it’s like that ain’t gonna work with your spouse now.

You don’t have to contact everybody and every every time somebody you can forgive with without them knowing, because it’s something you gotta do. Yeah, And then the last step is, I would say conditional, which is really reconciliation. So once, once you really faced it and you’re feeling what it feels like you’ve chosen to forgive. Then I think the goal is to seek Oneness again, his reconciliation appropriate in this place in this instance. And I think a lot of that depends on how the other person has responded.

Have they accepted responsibility? Have they expressed remorse? Are they desire ing to turn from whatever they’ve done to hurt you and restore relationship? And so there is a difference between forgiveness and reconciliation. Right? Forgiveness takes one person I choose to forgive. Reconciliation takes two I’ve chosen to forgive. And that other person has chosen to step towards me as well that if that makes sense now, that makes sense. I mean, that’s because, I mean, that’s probably a big issue for most. Where, I guess Is that a check?

Really, of did I really forgive? Like I forgive you, but I’m not willing to reconcile. That’s that’s kind of a red flag. Yeah, not always. Yeah. Okay, so let me know what toys you say. Yeah. You really, Really. If you still have hurt or reasonable. If you have heard of resentment, you probably not forgiven Vivian. Instance. Let’s say my spouse is physically abusive to me. All right, I have to forgive. Still, Biblical mandate. Right? But reconciliation right now may not be healthy if that person is not willing to change their behavior is physically not say for me the same thing.

You have a spouse that’s been unfaithful. If they, uh, basically say, I’m sorry, I want to work on it again and I’m changing my behaviour. Reconciliation makes sense, you know, if they’re non repentant. Well, yeah. I mean, it’s just but because, you know, you’re not meet me where I’m at and there’s repeated effects, then reconciliation may not make sense in that, because that’s where you got to set boundaries. You gotta set expectations of behavior and that kind of stuff. So get back. I’m not a toy ago with way so bandwagon and I don’t like them anymore.

I’m not on that. So you all for joining us with The RelationShop today. I’m Toya and I have Eric and Jason.

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